Eshin Direct

Write a new comment 26 comments

1. Permalink # David said

   Is it true that he was a member of the Hitler Youth?

2. Permalink # Eshin said

   Wouldn’t know… but he was born in 1927, making him the right age to be part of the junior members of the Hitler Youth.

3. Permalink # ellenvdr said

   Even if he was – wasn’t every youth in his time and how much influence did they have at age 14-15?
   Give hime time, pre-judging is too easy.

4. Permalink # David said

   I agree, but just wanted to know a bit more about this period in his life.

5. Permalink # Eshin said

   Yeah, pretty much most people at that age were, so no surprises there.

   As regards to giving him time, how much time do you need? The guy is already 78 years old and taking up the position of leader of 1.1 bn Catholics worldwide, at a time when most leaders of any organisation are usually retired.

   Regardless of his Hitler Youth affiliations, which he can be forgiven for, he already has his whole life as a track record. Given that he was the Pope in waiting as John Paul II was ailing, it’s not likely that he’ll change.

6. Permalink # kipper said

   Your blog is normally good mate. This was an awful post. Sorry

7. Permalink # Eshin said

   As in?

8. Permalink # David said

   Prob a catholic….

9. Permalink # Eshin said

   Careful… my mum’s side happens to be Catholic.

   And I’m reasonably sure he isn’t. That’s why I was wondering why he took offense.

10. Permalink # kipper said

    Eshin – I didn’t take offense, just thought the post was bad. Sounded like something I would expect to read in The Sun or The Daily Mail.

    David – No, I’m not Catholic. Are you Jewish?

11. Permalink # Eshin said

    Well, my writings never been all that amazing so I can’t really understand why you’d be expecting such a high standard from me.

12. Permalink # David said

    Yes I am, why?

13. Permalink # kipper said

    Eshin – no you misunderstand me. I’ve read your stuff for a long time so I’m well used to the way you write (not that there’s anything wrong with it). It’s not how you wrote it, it’s what you wrote. Sounded like a tabloid trash story.

    David – seeing as you liked to jump to the conclusion that I was Catholic, I thought I’d jump to the conclusion you were Jewish.

14. Permalink # David said

    Who’s jumping? Using logic here…You did not like his post, so assumed you were Catholic, as Eshin was not very complemetary about Benedict XVI. You aasumed I was Jewish from my name? Very smart of you…We have an expression in Hebrew – Shakli Be Tachat…

15. Permalink # Eshin said

    The first paragraph is entirely true though.

    The Inquisition survived within the Catholic Church until the early 1980′s when it was renamed the Centre or Office for the Doctrine of the Faithful. Ratzinger headed that Office within the Vatican.

    Ratzinger has come down hard on those that theologically question the traditional views of the Catholic church. He vehemently opposed an iniative by Asian Catholics to embrace different spiritual backgrounds (as they were losing much ground to new “Christian” offshoots). I’m not entirely sure whether he had them excommunicated, funding withheld or what.

    He’s been the traditionalist voice in the late John Paul’s ear. John Paul II once asked for forgiveness for the Catholic Church, and said Catholics must forgive too. It just makes it harder with an inquisitor on the papal throne.

    The Catholic Church needs a new lease of life to it. When I mockingly suggest that the faithful continue to fill the Vatican coffers, it’s because Catholism will lose more of its dwindling flock as it become disconnected from serving real world spiritual needs. But then, the Vatican has plenty of cash from its property assets worldwide, weekly donations, and almost a millenia of worldwide rape and pillage of those who opposed her.

    John Paul II was a liberal yet he stuck to some traditional hardline views. With Ratzinger, it almost becomes a certainty that no more liberalism within the Church will continue. And even the liberal moves made by John Paul seem in jeopardy now.

16. Permalink # David said

    Good post…

17. Permalink # Eshin said

    Forgive me my style on the day that posted up about the new pope. It was with some disgust that I saw Ratzinger accept his nomination for the papacy. The man embodies intolerance in my view and it is something that screams against fibre of who I am as a Christian.

    Ah yes, the great Wiki as a source of established knowledge. I can go in there right now myself and right up all the stuff that I’ve just said here on my blog and it will get published up there. That is until a writer with say a Catholic bias comes along and changes it. Not a definitive source for definitions that come in different shades of grey. Guaranteed, if I look up the Vietnam war it will have been written by hard right American patriots or American apologists. How many Vietnamese have access to the Internet? That’s Wiki for you.

    My sources? I read a few books on the Inquisition. My interest in religion and spiritualism went back long before Dan Brown’s own assertions. There were also a number of articles in Time magazine on Ratzinger before John Paul II died. Actually, none of my statements come from any of Brown’s books. My dislike for the Catholic Church stemmed way before that, at about the same time I discovered a loathing for extremist religious organisations the world over. The road to God is a personal spiritual journey.

    Religion is a form of control, pure and simple. In this regard, it perhaps shouldn’t be transient and should remain rigid. But it should always strive to be contextually relevant for the people in the contemporary for it to strive to be a meaning more than a control. Values are changing and interpretation of these values are fluid.

    Perhaps we should stop eating pork? The Bible does tell us this and it is traditional for Christians not to eat it in accordance with the Bible. It’s also nice to know how we can handle our slaves because the Bible happily lays this out for us.

    Catholicism is atoning for its past. John Paul II began that process but with Ratzinger I doubt it will be easier to continue that atonement. The Inquisition should have been abolished utterly and completely, not renamed and reformed. That would have been one gesture at least to atonement.

18. Permalink # kipper said

    David – using the sort of faux-logic you used, I assumed you were Jewish because you asked about the Hitler Youth.

    We have an expression in Greek – Filese to kolo mou…

19. Permalink # kipper said

    Thanks Eshin, your last post is the sort of thing I expect to see on your frontpage. I know it’s your blog and you can write what you want, but I’ve supported it since the beginning so I feel like I should say when I think it’s fallen below standards. As for your latest comment posting, I don’t have the time to check everything you’ve said and comment on it.

    On one point though, you are obviously wrong – “it’s because Catholism will lose more of its dwindling flock” The Catholic church is in fact growing – mostly due to its spread in Latin America and Africa (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Roman_Catholic_Church#Worldwide_Distribution). I think you should have a read of the information on Catholicism in Wikipedia – it offers a much more rounded view than you seem to have. Also, you might want to read this article on the new Pope (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pope_Benedict_XVI) – again a much more rounded view of his influence. (I must confess I’ve only skimmed both articles I’ve just linked to – they may turn out to be less rounded than I believe).

    At the risk of offending, may I ask where you get the information you base your opinions on? I seem to remember you were quite enamoured with Dan Browns The Da Vinci Code (a book I haven’t read). Does some of your info come from there?

    As I think we’ve discussed before, I disagree with your notion that the Catholic church should modernise. In my opinion the church should deal in the absolutes of its doctrine – if liberalism isn’t part of that, so be it. I think, in fact, that the late John Paul II was actually quite conservative/tradionalist. Reaching out to other faiths etc. was a good thing, but not necessarily a liberal move. I think the liberal issues are more in the area of contraception/homosexuality/female priests. On these, I don’t think the new Pope will deviate much from the old one, so I don’t see which liberal moves he will jeopardise.

    Finally, “Can we expect the Catholic Church to do things like atone for its past?” Should we? My word, if we asked for every nation/institution/religious body to atone for thousands of years of their past, we’d be listening to it for the rest of our lives…

20. Permalink # Eshin said

    David and Kipper – since I neither speak Hebrew or Greek, we have a saying in English…

    Quit bickering…

21. Permalink # Eshin said

    Actually, I do use Wiki and for scientific things and things that are absolute it’s quite useful. But for political stuff or debatable stuff it’s quite open to flaws. Still, a nice initiative. Incidentally, I did read the Wiki articles on Ratzinger and it confirmed much of what I wrote earlier.

    And yes, I’d like to back up my points with a bibliography, but these days I don’t even have time to post, so quoting anything is likely to be a miracle.

    Call me a snob, but books published have to go through some editorial process and, laugh though you might, they set a certain standard. I’m all for open source and stuff (hell, I’m running a business on it) but you still need to have some form of standard or something. Don’t mistake what I post up here on the blog as rationalised thesis paper material (go figure!) or even masquerading as journalism.

22. Permalink # kipper said

    “Don’t mistake what I post up here on the blog as rationalised thesis paper material (go figure!) or even masquerading as journalism.”

    Fair point. Sorry.

    “…books published have to go through some editorial process and, laugh though you might, they set a certain standard.”

    Sorry, that’s just not true. Is there an ISO standard for publishing books? Don’t think so. An editorial process for privately published books sets no other standards than that of profitabilty and being legally-watertight, as far as I am concerned. Some authors/editors/publishers have high standards, but to paint the whole industry with the same brush is naive. Reminds me of when people argue that something published in a newspaper must be fact (slightly twisted analogy, I know).

    On the point of open source – in terms of software, at least, some of it does conform to standards – SUS and POSIX for the UNIX OS, for example.

23. Permalink # Eshin said

    Yes, but even with the open source benefits, there is still a lot of poorly written code out there.

    No, I know that argument was weak about the editors and publishers… but we can still but hope…

24. Permalink # kipper said

    On Wiki – It’s an open-source enterprise, so obviously the nature of its information is open to debate. I didn’t propose it as the fountain of all knowledge, merely as a source. When I try to argue a point, I like to back it up with a source(s), so that other people can check out the information for themselves. It’s the basis for an informed, reasonable debate. As you haven’t quoted a single source in any of your arguments, I fail to see your basis for ridiculing Wiki as a valid source. To say you have “read a few books” is really not a great way of backing up your points. More to the point, you mention that Wiki entries could easily have been written by hardliners (or somesuch) with biased opinions – Books are different how? Moot point, poor reasoning.

    (Btw – I have used Wiki fairly extensively for info relating to science. In that respect it is almost 100% accurate, most of the time. You should have no worries using it for that. Also, the fact that Wiki is open to peer-review from everyone would tend to point to the fact that, over time, articles (of a less definite nature than science) would head towards a middle-ground. (Damn, I was reading an interesting paper on this subject but I can’t remember where from). Can you say the same for a book written by a single person and edited by only a few? A quick example – Fingerprints Of The Gods by Graham Hancock was published, became a bestseller, and was subsequently disassembled by certain scientists who didn’t like his wanton use of astronomy (amongst other things)).

    Now, I’m not arguing your opinions or beliefs – they are your own and not my business. But I will argue a point which, on inspection, appears to be based on preconceptions rather than evidence. You may be right, I may be right, we may both be right/wrong, but at least we can discuss it reasonably.

    I agree with some of your views on organised religion – I’m not a fan myself.

25. Permalink # Sylvester said

    After reading this page, I think both of your arguements are wrong. Kiper’s more than Eshin’s.

26. Permalink # kipper said

    Thanks for clarifying that for us…